I know tons of professional artist who use ref for the line art, the proportions because one line out of place will mess the whole drawing up. They omit to tracing....Who cares art is art...doesn't matter how it was created.

and even if you use a ref pic like my star wars one, it still is not the same as the ref no matter how good the artist is.

I have noticed my original art gets lower rates than the ones i use ref for...

and some one posted how would you feel if some one stole your art...well not stilling art I am learning from them, the reason you post the ref is show your appreciation. 

most of my ref anyways are from movie scenes or celebrities so didn't steal nothing.

Please people don't worry about rates draw to have fun, or draw to tune up your skills.

When you start worrying what rates you get or whether or not your going to make people mad you used a ref...you'll get no where on rmd.

I love art it lets you escape from the world around you. You can be anyone or be anywhere.

I learned by using refs. Seriously, I don't even think it is half fair that when I used a ref I got more rates than using my screwed up imagination.

Also, In my opinion, some people use refs because they like the picture, to get better at drawing different things (( we have to copy art in school ))

If you don't like fan art then just don't click the drawing :u

Something that must also be accounted for is that there are different ways to use a reference.  Not everyone "copies" a reference.  some use a reference(photographic) and completely transform the image to their style, or use several references and combine them into something new.  The old realists and impressionists used the landscape around them.  What exactly is different when using a photograph?  The old masters had their apprentices copy their work.  Many old masterpieces have been revealed to be the work of an apprentice, and not the master.  It is how we learn, and there is nothing wrong with it.  Using references is valid.  If you have a style as an artist, it is going to show itself regardless of whether or not you use a reference, or how closely you try to follow and copy.  I cannot think of any "style" of art that has not had resistance to it being considered "art".  As for fan art, have you ever seen the credits on a cartoon?  Do you really think there is only one artist at Disney studios who draws for a feature length film?  Nothing wrong with fan art.  I would hope that people vote based on what they see, without preconceived ideas.

4ever_Broken wrote:

I am being completely honest in saying that I hate fanart. Using refs for realism I get, becuause it is practice with shading, etc. especially when it is an original photograph.

But fanart? Fanart is a direct copy of something created by someone else. [<<<red*rouge mentioned this]

If you change the pose, okay, but um... hello?

The definition of ART- "Art is the process or product of deliberately arranging elements in a way to affect the senses or emotions. It encompasses a diverse range of human activities, creations, and modes of expression, including music, literature, film, sculpture, and paintings. ..."

~Artists have been striving to go by the definition of art, and stridently go against it. Just look at Dada artist Duchamp, art shouldn't be defined, therefore you shouldn't be one to criticize someone's catalysts for becoming a better artist.
   I like fan art for it just shows an artist's interest in a subject and enjoyment at attempting to re-create that. When people have a grand idea and need a reference to convey that, I don't see a fault there either.

I remember back when I was like 12 or 13 (I'm 16 now... don't go on too often as I used too) on this site no one ever talked about the use of refs haha, well I don't really mind the use of refs, what really matters to me is the quality and effort put into the drawing to make a good drawing. It's not like its super easy to use a ref, it takes time and effort, personally I don't use refs too often, only two drawings in my gallery (out of 11) has used a ref. And if I use a ref it's because I like the picture/drawing, and honestly it really helps you improve (manga specifically for most, realism kinda requires refs) I don't know just kinda wanna to express my opinion on the case. i hope im not bashed for my opinion >.<

END RANT. XD

@Mellmonster

I don't feel like quoting on a quote on a quote on an etc. (quoteception >_>? Too confusing to give it a term.)

To deal with it?

Not really. I think I'm the first who says that mentioning that you used a ref would be respectful to an artist.
Now that I mentioned it, there's a chance other people agree (:.

And come on, people.

8 characters (out of 250) are too much to waste on mentioning that you used a reference? ("Ref used"). There's no excuse for that :'D. If you have a lot to say, internet slang the rest of your drawingdescription.

Oh gawd, what kind of important information will go lost if you didn't have those EIGHT CHARACTERS. It'll be a catastrophe! *trolololo*

And seriously (not offensive) I don't care what reasons people have for reffing a draw.
I can't decide what people should draw and what they shouldn't.

If I had to say: "I never copied a draw" then that would be a lie.
When I was 10, I redrew Trunks from Dragon Ball Z. I took it everywhere, even to school. During Gym class. Put it in the changing rooms. I was in love with my own creation X'). My first love was my own drawing X'DDD.

ok. enuff.

You can use reference for practice.
But I think that the point of RMD is to show off your skills with your own original work or own original fanart.
^ captures all of my thoughs of ref using ^

And I know not everybody agrees with that, but that's how seriously I take my drawing things on this website >:\

I don't think fanart is a copy(< ref used). I mean, if I copy narutopicture using a copyingmachine, would the copymachine make fanart...?

AND what buhrd said

I'm never returning to this topic again. This is a never ending discussion anyways. There ain't no right and there ain't no wrong.

now to soften up the mood with something funny:

I don't really like when people copy stylized drawings- mostly manga, anime and cartoon stuff- but realism I don't mind for practise every now and then...

I think it's usually more fun and rewarded to draw your own style and works (although I do sometimes like to draw a photo of a person)


As for rating, it doesn't really affect how much I rate... more how likely I am to rate anything.
But then, I don't rate much anyway as I'm not on very often.

mellmonster wrote:

red*rogue wrote:

It's often that I don't notice if a ref has been used.
Artist often don't say it.
GIVE CREDIT WHERE CREDIT IS DUE.

I want to see the artist in the drawing. It doesn't feel original if I can't see the artist. Artists have their own unique style as their trademark and that's what I adore about the artists here. I can often recognize drawings and say which artist it belongs to.

This isn't Deviantart, you know?

People usually don't post a Reference because they don't like it when people compare the original with their version.
Besides that, I don't post references anymore either, because some people accuse me of things, without having any prove. Also, people who do use references, also draw Original's it's not like they only draw Fanart that's bull. (Not implying you said that. Lol)

Eitherway, Fanart is Fanart, we all have to life with it. It's not like it'll disappear after everyone's done complaining about it.
//END SERIOUS REPLY.

In my opinion, giving credit to the original artist is being respectful.

I usually go by the idea that everyone their drawing and stuff is 100% their own.
And sometimes I rate drawings and later figure out they have been copied. Completely copied.
And not mentioned. Mentioning that it has been originally drawn by somebody else is (to me) a sign of respect to the original artist. Even if you don't know who made it. Not mentioning it is like not showing respect to the original artist (to me).

And I just dislike copied drawings. Some people copy because they like it and I think that there are other people who copy because they're afraid their own original art won't be appreciated...